I can help users to debug their stuff, and i’m willing to do so. I’m obviously not as skilled as Olivier on his products, but i believe i already provided some help on several topics, as well as other users including yourself. But I must admit I’m not always opening threads when i see they’re about fixing a badly gone shruthi build.

I suppose the whole point is just for Olivier to let more time for the regular board users to do the job. Maybe some kind of “status” would help making the users confident about our advices. But I don’t think there’s some particular measure tu take. Everyone will do what he’s able to do whenever he can, and whenever he likes to. There’s no other way it works differently on internet, anyway.

A Status indicator would be a good thing. I don’t know if Vanilla is capable of this but it would be great having a Flag on every Troubleshooting Thread like green: solved, yellow:community at work and red: shit, olivier, we are to dumb . . .

I have stayed away from the more interesting call for support threads since I’ve been very afraid of accidentally writing something that could be construed as insulting. I’d be happy to help, but I’m firmly behind the suggestion above to compile a FAQ and troubleshooting guide.

It would be easy to write that bla bla bla is either:
a) easy
b) self evident or
c) learn to solder before taking the plunge building something expensive
but to be fair: NONE of us were born with our current knowledge and we all had to start learning, making mistakes etc.

Proper tools are also an important key to a successful project. Quality solder is also key. Private consulting/training/repair for a fee done by experienced members to help the newbs get up to speed. :)

I have tried to jump in where I felt (at the time) competent enough to answer. Unfortunately I suffer from delusions of grandeur. In more than half of those cases I was wrong or partially wrong (still wrong), only further confused the poor builder, and was eventually corrected by pichenettes when he found the mess and cleaned it up.

As a result, I have stopped trying to help and admittedly avoid those threads now.
So as much as I would love to help and am willing to help, I think that job may be best left to those of you who are a lot more experienced than I am and are already doing a fine job pitching in.

The FAQ is a great idea. I think a lot of these threads could be avoided with a few minor changes to the build instructions. Calling for (or optionally) a socket for the display, for example, would simplify support issues. Also calling for headers and shunts at the shorting connections rather than relying on a new builder to know to fill in those holes with a leg of resistor wire… That just makes sense to me, as a fellow non-expert trying to solder things together… I think those two things might eliminate 10% of the tech threads.

How about making either a sticky thread or page on the main site with advices regarding soldering and tools, aimed for the “noobs”? I’ve made a lot of mistakes myself that could have been prevented by using proper tools and techniques. For instance, I started with led free solder and a bad soldering iron a long time ago. Not recommended.

I agree with fcd72, so I guess its the thing of being willing. I work as an electronics tech, so my job is literally troubleshooting. I see a lot of those threads, but never really jump in because of what jojjelito said, most can be directed to the FAQ or can be solved by something as simple as having the right tools or doing a few kits before the “plunge”. I would definitely want to help share the burden, olivier has done a LOT for the diy community, and this would obviously be a great way to repay him, and help him out. Whatever you guys decide (I have no useful input, I think a status would be great though) I’m on board.

Maybe a mass email to all the “technical” people would be useful letting them know they have “work” in? I don’t check the board everyday, and tend to straight to the couple threads I follow closely, so I generally miss the “My 4pm isn’t working” threads.

@xtrmnt thanks for the tips (no pun intended). I’ll definitely check them out. It’s good timing actually. I think my current reel of solder is close to running out.

a|x

Would it help also to have a user-summitted ‘parts’ page, with links to Mouser/Farnell/Digikey baskets for the different projects, and tips for sources of the more obscure components?

a|x

I don’t think we need tickets, thats maybe a bit to formal but we need to somehow mark the Status of the Thread.

Would it be feasible to enroll the willing to a limited Kind of Administrator so these can change the Status of the Thread?

The first one answering would be in charge to have this problem either solved (not necessarily by him/herself) or passed to the Godfather of Troubleshooting himself, so each Case would have a personal sponsorship.
Flagging a thread read (surrender!) would require writing a short Summary of the Case so the next Troubleshooter (aka Oliver…) wouldn’t have to read thru pages of derailment. So Olivier only would have to look for red flagged threads.

Maybe we are able to compile an additional Troubleshooting WIKI for all of the Mutable Instruments DIY Range instead of compiling a simple FAQ. The Case from the solved Threads should be put in there.

As an incentive Id like to offer an otherwise unavailable Mutable Instruments Branded Key Ring Button ;-)

6581punk – hmmm what will happen if someone buys a kit, builds it, breaks it, comes over here, none of you can solve the problem and it fires back on me because the guy expected a higher level of assistance? I’m tempted to do the opposite indeed, big text in red telling people again and again that they are responsible for getting their kit to work.

This thread is based on the premises that my everyday troubleshooting on this forum (“oops, you swapped those 2 resistors”) is painful. It is just a little bit compared to the bulk of support nightmare which happens through private email.

You’d be surprised by the number of people reclaiming “exchanges” or “warranty” because they failed building their kit. It takes a lot of patience to explain them. What you also have to keep in mind is that there’s a small but reasonably sized category of people who are terribly ashamed at the idea of talking about their mistakes on the forum. Not to mention the folks who can’t write english.

In the end, if someone 1/ can reasonably explain their problem in english ; 2/ accepts participating on the forum and writing publicly about their mistakes ; 3/ is smart enough to use a wiki or ticket system ; it meets some level of “nice guy”-ness and is not really a support nightmare.

I can personally attest to the veracity of his claim.

Edit: Sorry Olivier :-\

Tough issue.

One clear option is to force support to the forums (stop answering support emails in most cases – send them here). Then allow a bigger delay in your responses to see if the community can handle it.

This may hurt a bit as some embarrassed people may just give up and then have not-nice things to say about the products (or at least not use and promote them). But it will buy back time for other stuff which allows for more products etc.

IMO, your support is second-to-none. I think you’ve got room to back it off a bit and spend more time on other things. A lot of people will work out their own problems given a few hours or someone here can help them. Personally I feel good if I get a support response within 24 hours. Here it’s often a few minutes.

My 2 cents

@pichenettes I didn’t realise you had to deal with so many help requests via email. I don’t remember having bothered you by email, but if I have, I apologise.
That does put things in perspective a bit.

I think you could legitimately direct future email support requests to a putative future Wiki, and/or this forum.

We all have a vested interest in finding ways to help you to continue making and selling DIY products in the future.

a|x

you people here write too much stuff, I really can’t keep track of all the comments. anyway I think I’m totally out of the question when it comes to technical stuff. anyway I offer my services to tweak the forums so that they work with this idea

The problem with any written documentation is getting people to read it :)

My product? I’m not the boss :)

I think clickable image maps of each board would be handy. Explain each section and voltages expected on key pins. Olivier posts these sorts of images already. But having them all in one place in an interactive form would be handy. Perhaps have an image of the PCB (detailed enough to see resistor colours) and then also the section of the schematic by the side of it.

Alternatively when you hover over points on the PCB it lists the voltage expected there? or when you hover over a component it shows the colours or markings?

In some of the MIDIBox projects (MB-6582) they have part numbers, values and then a little image of how it should look typically. It is quite useful.

6851punk: that’s a great idea! Talk about a perfect self-help tool.

Who knows how to make them?

One more vote for IRC channel! :)

Ticketing have advantages, it is formal and you can ensure you get all of the required information as there is a minimum data set.

But the advantage is also disadvantage as nobody really wants to sift through loads of issue reports?

rumpelfilter is right about both:people want a personal answer and the entry barrier for eMail support must be adjusted so only the crucial cases get thru.

My suggested way of operation would be sending everyone with a Problem first to the WIKIs Troubleshooting Section, if the Problem isn’t solved then to the Forum and the Moderator (member of this fine soon to be Panel) of the corresponding thread could decide when the problem is either solved or if its time to hand out a Formal Ticket. This way people are forced to DIY even with their Problems and only have “professional” help as a last resort.

I’m not 100% on the ticket system, either. Our IT department here at work has one, and to be honest, everyone I’ve spoken to hates it. It certainly doesn’t make me feel reassured that my problem is being dealt with my anything other than an annoying badly written program that spews out endless lines of unreadable apparently meaningless drivel somewhere in the middle of which is an actual request for more information from an actual person that I never actually manage to find in the torrent of textual effluent in which it floats, so I don’t reply, leading inevitably to my ticket eventually being closed, the work not being carried out, and leaving me several days later to go through the whole turgid process all over again, or take the more pleasurable option of simply banging my head against the nearest available hard surface until I no longer care, or can even remember, why I started the whole sorry process in the first place.

Just my experience, though, YMMV. Don’t let that sway you, either way.
;)

a|x

the problem with ticketing has the huge disadvantage of making people believe that we owe them a solution for their problem.

edit : the wiki seems to be a good solution.
And as volunteers, we shall translate it into several languages.

I think the most trouble people are having are some who speak romance languages. I guess Spanish would be first in line. Italian, French and German are also big languages. Anyway, who am I to pass judgement? Where there’s interest I guess work will be done.

Us Scandinavians tend to just shrug and go with English since we’re used to having our languages regarded as “small”. Also, we don’t dub stuff on TV so we’re immersed in English anyways. Must be harder for people with less exposure.

I hate ticket systems too, but it does create some sort of organization to the madness. Also, after using Bleo’s Mouser BOM for the Polivoks, I have had to place additional orders for parts now on 2 separate occasions because the BOM was missing parts. Now given I really appreciate Bleo’s efforts, I think a Wiki site would be an excellent place to post all BOMs “tested” or “untested”. Because these Mouser BOMs are listed as a thread in these forums, if I do a search for “Mouser BOMs” I get a couple pages of Ambika Mouser BOM stuff before I get to the Polivoks BOMs for Mouser. Forums are great for discussions, but a formal organized place for essentials is needed imo.